Building a Life in Identity Design with Ben Loiz

Ben Loiz: Growing up, I was always interested in drawing and painting and these things. Even in my teens was doing murals and things like that on the East Coast. And when it came time to go to school, I thought the best option for me, my interest would be art school. My formal training is fine art: drawing, painting, sculpture. And at the time, although I had maybe unknowingly done some design for friends, I didn’t know what design was really. So, it was in school where I met some working designers, really just great, talented designers in Atlanta, Georgia, and really just worked under them or asked questions, read their books, got some help.

A number of these designers, which I had maybe you could say unofficial apprenticeships with, began to send me some work or projects that they didn’t have time to do, and I began to work in that way. And a number of the designers that I was with at the time, or working with or friends with, had their own businesses. So, it seemed like something that could be done. Anyways, here and there I’d be taking jobs, working on maybe a flier for someone or a logo for someone or different kinds of projects, and then I just decided at some point to begin my own company, to start my own studio.

It actually went through a few different phases. At first, I was doing a lot of different kind of work, just taking whatever came in. Somewhere in between my wife and I even began an apparel line, like a product line, apparel line, and then after some time I transitioned to Ben Loiz Studio which I’m running now, focusing more on branding and identity.

I don’t know if that fully answers your question but that’s the way it happened. The way I learned design was through these unofficial apprenticeships, and this is something I still am very passionate about and interested in. So, even today, I practice to have some who are working with me and learning in that way. I feel it’s a very beneficial way to learn and to learn the craft and the skills and even the business side of design.

Ian Paget: I totally agree. I know myself, I learned a lot over the span of my career from mentors, so it’s really nice to hear that you do that. Your story is fascinating, so I really appreciate you sharing that with us.

I noticed with your logo design work that your style is very similar to designers such as Paul Rand. It’s very minimal, very clean. Where did that come from, since you have a fine art background as you mentioned?

Ben Loiz: Yeah. Well, I’ve always been interested in simple things, and maybe throughout the year this aesthetic has been solidifying and becoming a little bit more clear. It’s hard to say, because although my work is somewhat clean and very minimal, I also like to show the human touch in my work. I think that comes from using my hands, using pencils, using paint. So, along with a very clean, iconic, simple style, there is also the human hand element within it.

As far as how did the aesthetic of simplicity come, I think it’s just something that I’ve been attracted to and always am impressed by when I see a solution that’s so clear and so simple. It’s one of the most, I feel, the most difficult parts of design, to take a complex problem or a multilayered situation and find a way to boil it down to something so simple that communicates without distracting.

This is something that has always attracted me and drawn me in and gets me excited when I see it. But then along with that, and to balance that, I also really enjoy seeing that a human was involved in the making of that thing. So, a lot of times you’ll see in my work pencil marks or paint or cut paper, things of that sort, which probably come from the more hands-on training that I’ve had in the past.

Ian Paget: Well, that’s amazing. And for sure I can see that in your work. This actually leads on really nicely to another question I have for you.

As I noticed on Twitter recently, you posted a picture of a sketch you did, and alongside that was the final logo. Now, the sketch itself, it was very carefully planned. I could see that you did it on gridded paper, and you’d even included measurements on there. Having them next to each other, if you compare the two, they were almost identical.

Based on that, it’s just really clear that you do all of your thinking and logo development work actually directly on paper, but only use a computer to finalise the artwork itself. So, would you be able to talk through your process? Because I’d love to know how you work on a logo from start to finish.

Ben Loiz: Yeah, sure, sure. I do really enjoy, again, pencil and hand and hitting pencil to paper. But of course the process, the overall process from beginning to end starts before that. And so I’ll normally have a phase of research, which includes sometimes visiting the business of the company I’m working for. Most of the time, either talking to or interviewing either the owners or the staff members. Sending a questionnaire and getting some specific and crucial information to set the direction for the project. Competitor audits, looking at the competitors and really comparing and trying to see what they’re doing and how they’re many times copying one another, in order to help my particular client to stand out. Some industry research and things of that nature.

So, there’s normally a first phase of getting to know the client, getting to know their industry and what sets them apart, what makes them unique and different. And sometimes it’s even solving a particular problem that they can’t see, or I would say finding a problem that they can’t see.

From there, there’s a second phase, which I just call the direction phase, and in this phase I organise information, develop a design brief. I know many times the design brief in many designers’ processes start before, but I normally develop a brief after the phase of research. They may have made one before, but I normally try to find make a crystallised, simplified version of the brief so that we can agree that we’re going the right direction.

It also might consist of word studies, sketching, mind-mapping, all of these things to basically set the direction of the design process in that particular project. And so from there, I normally sketch quite a bit. There are some projects where the idea and the sketches will happen very quickly and I’ll land on something. And there are some projects even that just to start quickly sketching things out in vector, I’ll also start in Illustrator while I’m sketching. But most of the time I’m just in the sketchbook in this part.

Then after a lot of sketching, I’ll select a few directions. Normally somewhere around five directions, from maybe even a few hundred sketches. And begin to refine them. Again, this is where the simplification process happens, how can I make this more simple, communicate a little more clearly. And if the end project is going to be a vector, this is where the vectorisation project would happen of the directions.

But then from here, I would select the top maybe one to two options, and begin to create a presentation. And I feel the presentation is a very crucial part of the design process. Actually, all of these parts I consider design, not just the part where your pencil’s on the page or where you’re in Adobe Illustrator. But the research, the phone calls, the conversation, the experience they have with you, the comfort level that you’re able to bring, the answers that you’re able to provide or at least the direction that you’re able to provide, all of this is part of design.

So, then presentation is very important. Being able to clearly communicate the process that we’ve been through together, the designer and the client. I normally show a presentation in person or via Google Hangout or something like that. I’ll create a PDF or keynote and go through the whole process with them, the process of research, direction, design. This will be all included in the presentation, which we’ll show not only these things but the logo and application. Show some various applications on products, on social media, different things.

And so I’ll normally show one to two options, but the client is made aware that throughout the whole process, that I wasn’t just working on one option. There’s been maybe hundreds of directions. But I just feel my job is to find the direction that is the most clear, that is the most solid, the strongest direction, and present that. And so I normally do it that way.

I know designers have different ways of doing this, but I’ll normally show one to two. Sometimes, they’ll like what they see, sometimes they’ll have some questions about it, either practical questions about their business or maybe even subjective questions about likes and dislikes. But there is opportunity to go through a phase of changes and things like that.

Then normally a handoff will include providing the logo or the identity parts in different files and formats, creating an identity guide, things like that. Getting things off to the press. That’s maybe a detailed process that I normally work along.

Ian Paget: Okay. There’s a couple of things that I’m quite curious to know a little bit more about. In terms of the physical presentation, I assume that sometimes you’re doing it in person, sometimes you’re doing it online via a telephone call. How are you doing that when you’re not actually able to be in the same room with that person?

Ben Loiz: Can you get a little more into it? What do you mean how?

Ian Paget: Yeah. In terms of physically doing your presentation, are you literally just sending them over some kind of PDF file and talking through it?

Ben Loiz: Oh no. I never send any document via email and just have them pump it open.

Ian Paget: Right.

Ben Loiz: Normally, if it’s via Google Hangout or something like that, we’ll have a scheduled time that we’ll meet.

Ian Paget: Okay.

Ben Loiz: And then I’ll share my screen and I’ll walk through the presentation page by page and describe. But I never send anything out via email until-

Ian Paget: Right, I understand, I understand. It’s basically a Google Hangout. You’ve got full control over what they’re actually seeing at each stage of the process.

Ben Loiz: Right.

Ian Paget: I’m just curious. That actual physical presentation, is that a PowerPoint presentation or a Keynote, or are you doing that as a PDF?

Ben Loiz: I’ll normally do a Keynote or a PDF. For a PDF on Google Hangout, I’ll just share full screen so all the other graphics and icons on the sides will disappear. But Keynote is quite nice to use as well.

Ian Paget: Oh, fantastic. Also, you mentioned about sending files. It’s a topic that I haven’t really spoken about much on the podcast, and I know there’s people at different levels of their career that might be listening to this. So, just for the sake of those, are you okay just to explain through the final files that you might send a client once they’ve actually agreed the logo?

Ben Loiz: Sure, yeah. I’ll normally send a document and I’ll just number the folders inside the document. It’ll be a zip file. Number one will be an identity guide, their identity guide. I normally let them know to take a look at that before they get into all the other files. Then I’ll send eps files. If the logo has a full version and a symbol, or maybe it has a vertical and a horizontal lockup, I’ll send all the eps files that way.

I’ll also send high resolution jpegs, 300 DPI, and then low resolution pngs without a background, transparent pngs. I’ll send them a Favicon, a number of icons for their social media kit. And if there’s anything else included in whatever first phase we’ve worked together, let’s say there’s some business cards or there’s some photography that they’ve purchased as part of their identity.

Once the project is signed off and final payment is made, they’ll get an email, a zip file, very organised, with all of those kinds of file formats that they can use, and a little short email with directions on how to use them. Of course, they can either send those off to their in-house design team, or if we continue to work together then of course I would use those files. But they have everything on hand to use from that point out.

Ian Paget: I’m curious to know, what’s the reason where you send eps as opposed to an Adobe Illustrator file or a PDF for example?

Ben Loiz: Well, I actually do sometimes send Adobe Illustrator files. Sometimes it depends on what the client wants, but I guess the main decision is a vector file and a pixel file. That’s why I send one that’s either an AI or an eps and then a jpeg.

Ian Paget: Yeah, that makes sense.

Ben Loiz: Yeah.

Ian Paget: Okay. Now, I’ve noticed on your portfolio, your portfolio looks really impressive and it makes use of a lot of what looks like physical photography. I assume it’s physical photography as opposed to mock-ups. I don’t have the opportunity to do this type of thing, so I’d like to learn a little bit more about it from you if possible.

At the moment, I use these mock-ups that you can find online where you open it in Photoshop and you apply the logo and it looks real. But when you do it as photos in the way that you have, it looks so much classier, it looks so much more premium, it just looks more impressive. So, I’m just curious, how are you actually going about doing that? Are you doing that yourself or are you hiring someone to do it?

Ben Loiz: Yeah, I’m doing that myself. I would never call myself a photographer, but I’ve been doing photography for quite some time. I started in the maybe early 2000s, maybe, or somewhere around 2002, 2003, where I had a friend, a really brilliant photographer in Atlanta, Georgia, and he lived pretty close by and so I used to go to his studio and just learn, soak it up. I guess you could say, going back to the idea of unofficial apprenticeships, I just spent time with him. I also designed his identity and his print work for his photography business.

So, he used to just show me some tricks, some tips. He helped me get my first professional camera, which was a Nikon, and I still use Nikon. I know there are different likes and dislikes in cameras, but I currently a Nikon D5100 with a macro lens. The macro lens is what allows you to get those really closeup shots. For example, if you have a business card that’s on beautiful, uncoded paper, with Pantone colour for the printing, it’s nice to pick up some of that, to see the uncoded texture in the paper. Or maybe there’s some embossing or something like that. So, to get up really close you need a macro lens. So, that’s what I use. I just have a very simple setup in my studio and shoot everything that way.

As far as the templates, I know a lot of people use templates, and that’s great. Even sometimes I feel like the templates look better than the presentation of my work. I’m totally aware of that. It’s been made very easy to present work that looks high quality because of the templates. But for myself, I just feel more comfortable presenting images of work that was produced, especially when it’s in print. And I feel at least it shows some experience with materials, production, and a project that was followed through and completed successfully.

So, I like to use photography to show that texture and detail. There’s a sense, or the client has a sense this was actually printed on a vehicle, this was embroidered on apparel, this was made into back-lit signage, this was actually made. Just for myself, I feel more comfortable showing work that was produced. But again, I myself have no problem seeing portfolios using templates. And again, sometimes it looks really high quality that way as well.

Ian Paget: I think what I like about the photos is that you can see it’s actually real. Because I have had people call me and ask, “Is this real? Is this one actually a real business?” But it’s because I’ve been using mock-ups and stuff like that, and in some cases it’s pretty obvious it is because I’ve used the same one a couple of times. But with the photos, you can actually see it’s real. You can see the paper. For me, it looks more premium. So, I think for those of us that want to attract those higher-end clients with the bigger budgets, I do think the approach that you’ve taken is the best way to go. So, I think you’ve done an amazing job with that.

Ben Loiz: Thank you.

Ian Paget: I’m curious to know. I get the feeling that a lot of your clients are fairly local to you, but in the instances where say you’re working with an international client, how are you able to still do those photos?

Ben Loiz: Yeah, it’s tricky. Sometimes, the best bet is just to ask for photos or hope you can visit someday on your own. But I have a number of clients in other countries where it might be a little more difficult to get there. In most cases, clients are happy and excited to show how the identity is developing.

For example, if they’ve created a sign, they’re excited to show that sign. And so I’ll just hope they have a nice camera, or with my minimal Photoshop skills be able to enhance whatever they send me. And in other cases, I’ve hired photographers who are living closer, or if it’s at an event photographers who will be at the event where the branding will be on display, and just hire a photographer to go and shoot it for me.

Because again, for the majority of the projects on my site, I do like to have actual photography. So, I try my best to do it, to either hire a photographer or just ask for photos and work with what I can. But in some cases, the companies or the brands have a good photographer or will have a good camera, and it’s at least something you can work with to show. That’s how I’ve worked it with international or distant clients.

Ian Paget: A challenge a lot of freelancers face is work-life balance. I know myself, that sometimes I end up working late or evenings or weekends. It’s quite challenging to find that healthy balance. I’m curious, from your experience, how have you been able to grow your business whilst achieving a comfortable work-life balance?

Ben Loiz: Right. This is very important, I think, for all designers and people in any field. In a general way, as we go on in life we pick up more responsibility, which requires our time and attention. For example, I was once single and then I got married and that became something in addition to my own life that I needed to take care of and be responsible for. Then I was married with a new business. My wife and I also practice to serve in our community and with youth. This is another time and responsibility. Then we had a son. So, each of these require our responsibility, attention and care, and I feel, at least for myself, that as much as I can help it, none of these should suffer because I have a business and vice versa. In fact, in a healthy way, they can influence and inspire each other.

My son should benefit from watching a dad who endeavours to spend a lot of time with him, but also takes care of his business and has a passion for what he does. In fact, spending time with my son and witnessing his wonder and awe at everything new, inspires the way I should think as a designer. The many times hanging out with him at the playground causes me to think about how the design of the playground can be improved, or reading picture books with him has inspired me to sketch out and write and illustrate ideas for picture books myself.

Caring for all of these different responsibilities should enrich the other ones. In a sense, I’m not just a designer when I’m sitting in front of a computer, and I’m not just a dad or husband when I’m with my family. In a sense, I don’t look at it as much as a balance as … Sorry, like a work-life balance, as much as I do just endeavouring to properly take care of various things, various responsibilities, as best as I can.

The way that has helped me, the way that I do this or put this into practice, is scheduling. That may not seem that exciting and it may seen mechanical, but it’s helped me. And I personally have at least three layers of lists or schedules that I use to keep track of the different things going on in my life, projects, responsibilities, things like that. First, I have a yearly schedule of goals and I use trello.com, which is an online project management application, to create a list. This yearly list I make at the beginning of each year, and I look at it about once or twice a month. It’s really an overarching list of yearly goals. So, I’ll have a list of goals for my family, a list of goals for my business, a list of goals for personal projects. All of these things are in there and they’re the bigger things that I want to accomplish that year.

Then I have a second schedule, or list, that I also make on Trello and this is related to my business. And this is the workflow, the projects that I’m currently working on at that time, that particular week. And I can see what’s coming up behind, I can see what is in front, I can see different deadlines, parts of the project that I need to complete. I update this once or twice a week, just keep that updated, and that helps me to know, at least as far as my business, what needs to get done and how I need to schedule my time each day.

Then the third schedule I have, I use the TeuxDeux app. It’s a really beautiful, simple app. It’s spelled T-E-U-X-D-E-U-X. And it’s just a daily to-do app. On this list, I have a mix of family, business, daily tasks, and I update it every evening before the next day of work, to prepare for the next day. For this one, I check it throughout each day. Every time I accomplish something I’ll check off tasks. Really, this sets up what I need to accomplish that particular day. I have some of the larger tasks on there, but I also have smaller ones like a reminder to email this person back who asked me a question, or things related to my family or wrapping up this project because it’s due in the next day.

So, I use these schedules to make sure all those different areas of responsibility are taken care of and finished on time, that each one of them don’t negatively influence the other in that maybe unconsciously I’m spending too much time here so I’m late there, these kinds of things that cause us to have a lot of late nights and things like that. Not that sometimes that’s needed, but as much as I can, I try to schedule things out and keep track of things so that the other parts of my life, whether it’s my business or family or other things like that, don’t necessarily have to suffer because I’m not watching over each item.

This is a little bit of my thought related to the work-life balance, which is not as much as a balance as it is just making sure everything’s taken care of, in my case by way of the help of some scheduling and applications that I use to check off tasks.

Ian Paget: I’ve actually found myself that, I’ve been part-time freelance now for just over a year, and scheduling is probably, like you said, the one thing that really helps. I use Google Calendar, so it just means that I can block out when I can fit projects in. So, it’s important that I get that project finished by that date otherwise there’s a backlog.

But by doing that, when you do finish that on time, you know that you can stop and you can take a break. For me, that’s why I’ve been able to find a healthy balance between working too much versus doing not enough. And like you, we just use different tools, but I keep a note of everything that I want to do down on a piece of paper.

Ben Loiz: Right.

Ian Paget: And then I use a highlighter pen to say, “This is what I need to do now,” and then once I’ve done all of the highlighted things on that piece of paper I can choose to stop or I can carry on working through that list if I get it done on time. So, yeah, I agree with you.

Ben Loiz: Yeah. It’s question interesting because in the end, when you think about it, we all have the same amount of time each day. Of course, for some working into the night helps, but everyone has the same amount of time and sometimes you see some people who get a lot done and sometimes there are some who don’t get as much done.

But in the end, you realise both of those people have the same amount of time basically. It’s just how we use our time. And so when working for a company, there’s a time to come in, there’s a time to leave. The company or the project manager to come extent manages the project and getting it done.

But when you have your own business, you become the person that needs to look over those things. It not only helps you to not be so anxious about many things that you’re aware of, you have a little bit more of a control over how time is spent. It helps your clients in that they get what they need in good time, and those around you that are affected also. This is sometimes an overlooked aspect of running a business, but it’s very, very important.

Ian Paget: I also find by doing that, when you can say no, because for example at the moment I’ve got projects booked in for the next two months so I know that if someone comes to me and says, “I need this next week,” I know no matter how much they’re going to pay I can’t get it done without saying no to someone else. So, scheduling, you just know the volume of work that you can physically handle and it just ensures that you don’t overbook yourself.

Ben Loiz: Right, right.

Ian Paget: Now, I notice that you work with some pretty big names. You’ve worked with Nike and Coca Cola, for example. As a one-man-band, I’m curious to know, how did you get the opportunity to work with these big names?

Ben Loiz: Yeah. Most of my clients come by way of word of mouth, referral or by a client seeing work that was produced for another client and reaching out. And so as an example, for Nike, I had a client who was a friend, who I designed an identity for. I designed her logo and first website and some of her identity pieces, stationery and such. But she was also a curator, and so she was asked with another curator to select a group of designers and artists to promote Nike’s Joga Bonito campaign, design murals or make murals across Los Angeles for some of the teams who were going to be in the World Cup that year. It was a big promotional campaign for the World Cup.

I knew her because she was a friend and she was a client, and so I was one of the designers that was selected for this campaign. It was a quite fun project, an interesting project, where on the one hand I could have just, I don’t know, drawn a picture or made some type on the wall. But I was asked to make a mural for Brazil. All these teams were coming close to being in the World Cup that year. So, I was asked to make a mural in the neighbourhood of Little Brazil in Los Angeles, for Brazil. But the way it happened, instead of making a visual picture, I got some paint, blue, green and yellow paint, and a number of soccer balls and called some friends and family out because soccer’s a team sport.

And we dipped the balls into the paint and kicked and threw them at the wall. First layer was yellow, second layer was green, and third layer was blue. And when the balls hit the wall they made a splatter, but you could see the texture of the soccer ball in the splatter. In the end, it was this huge circular form, like a huge soccer ball form made of all these smaller hits, these paint splatters. And anyways, it was really enjoyable experience. I thought through the process the same way I think through an identity, considering the particular situation, who the client was, what they were doing, how to make this relate to the actual sport, and things like that. A project that would be simple but memorable.

And of course Nike, they had a film crew come out and film the designers who were out making these murals and made a time lapse video that was presented at an event here in LA at the time. I know I went a little further than your question, but most of the time my clients come in this way, by way of word of mouth, referral, something like that. And so it’s good and very helpful to have positive relationships with the people you work with. Even if a project doesn’t turn out you’d like or you have to end a project for a particular reason, it’s always good to have a positive ending because that client may need you to work on another project later or could refer you to a client later or may start another company later that’s better fitted and suited for you.

And so I think the relationship between designer and client is very important, and the way that we’re responsible for, to some degree, the atmosphere between the client and the designer, for having a positive atmosphere so that situations like this can happen. You never know what kind of help they’ll need in the future, or where your services can be referred to another client. Anyways, hopefully that answers your question.

Ian Paget: Yeah, it does. It’s a fascinating story, because I mean, at the end of the day, it came down to who you knew and there was an awareness of what you were able to do it and how you’re able to help businesses. It’s interesting, because even if you work with a small company, if a friend of theirs works for Nike then you’ve got the opportunity to work with big companies. So, that’s really fascinating.

Ben Loiz: Right, right.

Ian Paget: It made me think of another question. In terms of meeting people, getting to know people, actually physically meeting new clients, is there anything that you’re doing to proactively connect with new people?

Ben Loiz: Well, I connect with people a little bit online. I do maybe a little bit more closer to home. I’ll go out and meet clients, potential clients, at their businesses. Or if I see a new shop in town or a potential client that I’d like to, even if not work with just like to just be in a network with, I might stop by their office and just say hello and drop off some material. Or send them something in the mail or maybe send a quick phone call. That’s the way I’m meeting people in person, although there are also different design events and things like that. But that may be a better opportunity to meet other designers in your area.

Ian Paget: You mentioned about dropping something off at these businesses. Do you have some kind of pack that you give out or some information that you’re able to give out? I don’t know how many people actually do that so I’m just curious to know what is it that you actually give them?

Ben Loiz: Yeah, I do. Interestingly, I really enjoy printed items, which is a little bit different than digital marketing where you’re producing something digitally and changing it to suit different needs. But I have a few pieces, like for example a 24-page booklet called Marking Marks, which discusses the principles of logo design and shows a number of case studies, so that clients can see not only images of logos themselves but learn some of the process of logo design. I have this booklet, I have a number of cards that either the different designs on them or some informational cards concerning my services. Although some in this day and age might feel print is not as … you don’t have the return investment as clearly as you do with digital marketing, I really enjoy printed items and I think people enjoy seeing them too. I think people enjoy touching something, opening something, reading something, touching something that’s tangible.

Not that I don’t promote digitally either, but those are some of the printed pieces that I send, along with some specific material I’ll send out through the year to say thank you to clients and remind them of my business.

Ian Paget: I know you sent me a couple of times things like the booklets and little cards, and every time, because it’s so rare that people do that, I do take it as like it’s a really nice gesture and a couple of those things I’ve actually pinned up on my boards and stuff like that. I’ve found it inspiring. Just how you stick the stamps on there and how you actually physically write on it, you can see that it’s not just a batch mail shot. You’ve actually made an effort and put time into sending that out. So, if you’re doing that to clients as well, I can imagine that it has quite a personal impact on them. Even if they might not necessarily actually buy something now, they probably will think of you when they do need something.

Ben Loiz: Right. And I think those things are made, those printed pieces are made for a specific reason. For example, going back to the thought of digital marketing, a lot of time with digital marketing you’re trying to hit a particular return. And you try some things, you use some wording, you use some images, and if it doesn’t work you quickly switch if you don’t see a return and try to adjust your marketing scheme. But these items are really not made for that reason. They’re made to say thank you to clients and collaborators.

Yes, for sure, they are also made to reach out to new clients, but in many cases the mailings that I send out throughout the year are to say thank you. I feel it’s a real privilege to have the opportunity to be in this field, producing work that not only I enjoy making but that helps people businesses, and depending on their business model helps people, their customers. And so I send out the cards and materials as a way of saying thanks. So, it’s a little bit different of a view than your general marketing just to land a new job.

But I also, like I mentioned earlier, like to produce nice, tangible things. For example, I mentioned the printed booklet. It might just be an offset, uncoded postcard set, or this past year I produced a newspaper, found a newspaper printer in the UK and produced a newspaper. It’s enjoyable, just to produce these nice, tangible things, that in many cases people aren’t investing in anymore. So, I think they make a little bit more of an impact in this day and age when a client receives a newspaper, a custom-designed printed newspaper in the mail, rather than an ad that pops up on a social media channel. Yeah, it’s done for a little bit different reasons than other kinds of marketing, but that’s not to say that in producing these things there’s not the opportunity or even the hope that new work will come out of it as well.

Ian Paget: Yeah. I think it’s really nice that you’re doing that. Now, I read on your LinkedIn profile that you’ve been featured in a number of magazines and books. It sounds like both really good PR but also it’s something that a lot of us want. We want to see our work featured somewhere. So, I’m curious to know, how have you been able to get those opportunities?

Ben Loiz: I wish I had a better answer for this, but I think on the one hand it’s similar to the question you asked about clients, maybe something more related to word of mouth referral, things like that. But also just focusing on doing good work as much as possible. There’s probably a better person to ask related to strategy concerning these things than myself, and certainly others who have a lot of press and different kind of press. But for the magazines and books, I just really focus on doing good work.

From time to time I’ll meet someone who’s involved with a publication, a book or a magazine, and I’ll reach out to them and send something along to them. But in most cases, it’s a situation where a magazine, a company, or a new book that’s being released will reach out and send an email and just say, “Hey, we like the stuff that we’re seeing. Can we feature some in this book or this magazine?” For this, my advice would be more to focus on producing solid, strong work, than so much how-to, although there may be a good how-to that I just don’t know.

Ian Paget: You very much gave me the answer that I was hoping you would, because obviously there’s a lot of people out there that are intentionally trying to get this type of thing and it’s not happening. But I like that you’re basically continuously doing good work and connecting with people, and by doing so you’re able to work with big brands and you’re also getting featured in different things. So, literally by focusing on your craft and improving it and just doing good work for clients, those opportunities do come. I have thankfully had the same thing. I’ve been in a couple of magazines and that’s just by literally just continuously doing work and sharing. I haven’t been proactively looking for those opportunities.

Ben Loiz: Right, right.

Ian Paget: Now, I think just to wrap this up I’ve got one more question for you. If you could only give one logo design tip, what would that be?

Ben Loiz: One logo design tip? That’s tough because I think different projects and different logos require different tips. But maybe I would just say-

Ian Paget: It could be more than one tip, if it helps.

Ben Loiz: Okay. Yeah, I think so, I think so. Well, I could give one but maybe I’ll give you my top five.

Ian Paget: Yeah, go for it, go for it, that’d be good. Go for it.

Ben Loiz: Yeah. I think maybe the top help for logo design is to ask the question, “How can this be simplified?” I mentioned this before and I mention it here because again I feel it’s one of the most critical, crucial, and probably one of the most difficult tasks as a designer, how to simplify or present in a very simple, understandable way, a complex problem or situation, which many clients have.

There are a number of different helps or tips that work while designing a logo, and so I’ve actually recently created a graphic that I posted online of five questions to ask when working on a logo. And the first is just that, “Can it be simplified?” So, as you’re working on the logo, consider what is an extra part that doesn’t need to be there to communicate the same thing. Is there something related to this logo that is added another layer that makes it harder to remember or understand?

People, when they see logos, many times they’re passing by in a car or passing by on a bus or the subway, or they’re scrolling down a page on social media. And so a logo really should be something that … it certainly should express the sentiment of a company, but it should be very easily recognised and something that can be remembered. So, that’s where simplicity is so important.

But the second question is, “Is it relevant to the field?” And so on the one hand, we want the clients that we’re working with to stand out, to be distinct, but they should also look like they’re in the related field. In a sense, if you’re working on an identity for a hospital or a doctor, unless you’re trying to be funny and silly and have some kind of silly idea, their logo shouldn’t look like it’s for a beverage company. Do you know what I’m saying? It should be relevant to the field.

But the third question is, “How is it distinct?” Although it should relate to the field, it should be distinct from its competitors. That may be in the use of Sans or Sans-serif or Serif-type faces. If many of their competitors are using one or the other, you can use something different. Or maybe in colours or maybe in icons, sometimes a lot of companies, a lot of their competitors may just be using all capital text and no symbols. So, then you come in and design a symbol to cause them to be a little more distinct. Sometimes the distinction comes in the further messaging and things of that nature.

But then the fourth is, “What makes this logo memorable?” And sometimes it’s something that’s a little bit off about the logo, something that’s not so perfect, something that catches you off guard will make a logo more memorable. Then, in this day and age, does it scale well? This is important because today we’re not merely designing logos that are on billboards, but we’re designing logos that are browser icons as people are going to websites, the client’s website. So, all of these things really form, I feel, or can inform a very solid logo. So, there are five questions that can be asked while working on a logo.

But I would say maybe the top, for me, is can it be simplified? How can I communicate this problem, or this company, or who they are, or just a sentiment about them, in the most simple way that people can recognise and remember at a glance?

Ian Paget: Such good advice. That infographic that you mentioned-

Ben Loiz: Right.

Ian Paget: … is that something that you can share with me, and what I’ll do, I’ll put that in the show notes and I’ll get that shared out on social media as well? Because it sounds like some really top advice, so thanks for sharing that.

Ben Loiz: Sure, yes. Thank you.

Ian Paget: Okay, cool. I think we’ll wrap this up then. It’s been fantastic speaking with you. You’ve given so much to think about in this, so I appreciate your time, and I’m sure that everyone that’s listening will do so too. So, thanks very much Ben.

Ben Loiz: Yeah, thanks Ian. It’s been my pleasure. I’ve really been looking forward to having this conversation with you and I’ve enjoyed our talk.